question, every part of which would be thrown open for debate. (Hear, hear !)

He would not follow the speakers who had preceded him through all the topics they had discussed; indeed there were one or two of those topics, on the consideration of which he would not venture to trust himself; and others of which, speaking with all deference, he must say that he conceived them to be irrelevant. They had heard a great deal on the former day of the absurdity, the injustice, the tyranny, and the self-destructiveness of the laws of this institution, and they had just heard one at least of those laws reprobated in the strongest terms by the venerable Director who spoke last (Mr. Bebb). But the question did not comprehend so wide a field of argument-it was simply, as propounded by the Hon. Mover, whether certain classes of young men destined for their service in India ought, or ought not, to be obliged, according to what was called a compulsory clause of the last charter-act, to serve a certain number of terms at the College of Haileybury-the repeal of that clause was the real and only question in debate; and, unless gentlemen could shew that the grievances of which they complained necessarily emanated from that compulsory clause, he must ask, what possible application their complaints could have to the present question? If their objections were generally to the laws of the college, they might set on foot an inquiry having for its object a total alteration of these laws, and might recommend it to the Court of Directors to have the necessary conference for such a purpose with the Board of Controul. This was the natural course in such a case; and not a measure which would send the whole of the general question into the arena of parliamentary discussion. It was not his intention to enlarge upon the general laws of this institution: but when he heard it asserted in that Court, that statutes which had been framed for the college discipline by high and most respectable authorities, recommended by a majority of the Court of Directors, and approved by the Board of Controul when he heard that these were only worthy of the temper of the Spanish Inquisition, and that the mind in which they originated would, but for the humanity of the age, have been ready to exact evidence by the torture-he must be permitted so far to deviate from his original intention, as to say something respecting the regulation thus severely condemned.

He had, however, no wish to narrow the grounds upon which this question was to be argued, and would therefore venture shortly to inquire into two points. First, had the present system in any fair or reasonable degree answered the purpose for which it was intended? Secondly, was there any rational probability that the same Asiatic Journ.-No. 100.

purposes would be answered by the substitute proposed? With reference to the first: if the institution had reasonably answered the purposes for which it was intended, there arose a strong presumption against any change; as to the second, if it could be shewn that the proposed substitute was not at all likely to answer these purposes, then, in addition to the strong presumption against any change, there would be an irresistible presumption against the particular change recommended.

Between the Hon. Mover and himself, the former of these questions was hardly open to debate, for that gentleman had candidly admitted the merits of the college. But other speakers having argued that the institution had completely failed-that indeed it contained within itself the seeds of its own destruction, and one gentleman in particular, who said this, having professed to appeal to facts in support of his assertion,

it became necessary to examine the justice of such charges. Similar charges had over and over again been made out of doors; and he himself (Mr. Grant) had been taunted with certain predictions, which he was represented to have made seven years ago in that Court in favour of the college, and asked, in a tone of triumph, what he now had to say in support of anticipations which the event had disproved.

Now it was a very trite remark, that a great deal of controversy would be saved, if disputants would begin by defining their terms. In this, as well as in other arguments, it would perhaps be well if this rule were observed. He would then at once ask, what was the criterion of the success of such an institution as was now under consideration? The Court and the public had been told in glowing terms of expulsions and rejections, and the irremediable ruin which had covered the future prospects of several young men in life, in consequence of the deprivation of their Indian appointments. He trusted that he had, upon these private and domestic disap pointments, as deep a sense of the consideration due to the relatives of the sufferers as any person present, as warm a commiseration for the mortification they must have suffered. He had always lived with those who felt a sympathy for others; he respected their feelings as deeply and as sincerely as any member of that Court. (Hear, hear!) But it did not follow that, because such unhappy incidents had occurred, he must therefore admit his hopes respecting the college to have proved abortive. When he was formerly before the Court, he declared his belief that the institution had been eminently serviceable, and had foretold confidently, because he expected firmly, its eventual Now was it meant to be said that his prediction had been falsified, by the painful events to which he had alluded? In what VOL. XVII. 3 F

success.

sense had he predicted the success of the college? He had told them that he be lieved it would succeed, as a place of probation for the young men destined for their service in India, as affording a fit and conspicuous standard of qualification; as furnishing a discriminating test of merit. But a place of probation, in which there would be no failures—a standard of qualification which all indiscriminately would reach-a test which would neither try nor discriminate any-a measure which would fit every body without exception-he was so far from predicting, that the existence of such a chimera had never entered his wildest imagination. He knew then, as he knew now, that if they chose to institute a system of education which in its nature should be not only directory, but probationary; if they established tests and trials, and, collecting promiscuously a defined number of individuals, proclaimed that all who could not endure those tests and trials should be rejected; and, that if after this they were fond enough to persuade themselves that there would be no rejections, that every body without exception would be found to stand the test, and to endure the trial-then, indeed, would they soon discover that they had indulged hopes and expectations, which were utterly inconsistent with the immutable laws of probability, and that they had only themselves to thank for their disappointment. (Hear, hear!)

The true criterion of success which he meant was a very simple one, and it was suggested by the very nature of the case. What were the purposes for which the institution had been established, and had those purposes been in a fair degree auswered? In arguing this question, it was his wish, and would be his endeavour, in conformity with the judicious remark of an Hon. Proprietor (Mr. Twining) on a former day, to avoid that exaggerated praise, which only tended to injure its object. He had never predicated of this institution-he knew no institution of which it could be predicated, that it possessed the quality of perfection. In the course of the debate, indeed, it had been said by one gentleman, that the advocates of the college upheld it as unimpeachably perfect as an absolute paragon. He knew not who were the eulogists alluded to; but he wished that the Hon. Proprietor who had referred to them, would particularize the documents in which these alleged highflown descriptions were contained; that he would point out the men who had indulged in them, and the arguments which they had employed. (Hear, hear!) For himself, he had never committed himself in speculations so extravagant, and therefore it was unnecessary for him to defend them. The object of the establishment being to qualify the great body of the individuals

destined for the civil service of the Company, the test of its efficiency was to be sought in the actual fitness of those whom it had educated. The opinion of Marquess Wellesley had been quoted as to the deficiencies of the great body of their civil servants in India, antecedently to the existence of their collegiate establishments in England and India; and it had been contended that the delineation given by the Noble Lord in his celebrated minute was somewhat overcharged. Possibly that noble person might involuntarily have admitted a shade too much into the graphic and masterly portraiture, which, in the warm prosecution of a favourite subject, he had furnished of the defective state of the civil service in India; but the truth was, that Lord Wellesley had qualified his delineation by admissions which it was important to remember, and which had been too much overlooked. No impartial observer could examine coolly the history of their oriental possessions, without admitting the acknowledged merits of an integral portion of the civil servants in India at a much earlier period than the administration of Lord Wellesley; and especially since the memorable reforms introduced by Lord Cornwallis. No fair judge could venture to say, that the civilians of those earlier times exhibited a mass of defectiveness: perhaps the truth lay in the mean point. Many servants of merit, and some of great eminence, had, in the times referred to, existed in the civil establishments of India; but these were not sufficiently supported, and had to struggle against the serious disadvantages of a considerable quantity of incompetency, or at least imperfect qualification, among their brethren, and especially among the juniors. Their merits and these were not few nor inconsiderable-were their own; their defects were those of their situation and circumstances. With respect, however, to the improved qualifications of the general body of the civil service at the present moment, there could not be two opinions. All, he was convinced, would agree, that in point of integrity, ability, public spirit, disinterestedness, and general efficiency for the discharge of the important duties confided to them, the service never before stood at a pitch of excellence so high. (Hear!) They were not merely improved, but were in a state of progressive improvement; and even already constituted such a set of public functionaries, as it would probably be difficult to rival throughout the world. If this be so, he did not mean to say that it was owing exclusively to the college, for he knew that it was attributable to a conspiration of causes; to the energy of the administration both at home and abroad; to the increasing overflow of public opinion from Europe to the EastIndies; to the improved regulations which

had been introduced in India: and here he might particularize that important regulation which enjoined that no civilian should employ in his office any of his creditors-a provision which had the effect of diminishing, if not doing away, that unlimited credit, that had previously constituted the great pest of the civil service. He was sensible, also, that there were a great many improvements which must have their operation in the general scale, although it was difficult to assign to each its specific share: for the great merit of a good system of government was, that it was in its nature a self-ameliorating system; improvements springing up here and there spontaneously, like those delicate plants which were formed to grow wild in a fine climate, without the possibility of discovering the particular causes of their production. (Hear, hear!)

He would, however, state the grounds on which he claimed for the present system of education at Haileybury a certain share in the credit of having produced the admitted improvement in the civil service. In the first place, it would on calculation appear that of the whole body of civilians now employed in India, about five-sevenths had received their education at the college. Did he then advance an extravagant position, when he contended that some portion of the amelioration of the whole must in all probability be derived from the source which had supplied so large a part? Was it too much, that the increased richness of the stream was in a degree to be ascribed to this its principal feeder? He would say further, that there was this remarkable distinction between the present and past times that in the former period of their bistory the improvement descended from their higher to their lower servants, whilst now it was rather the reverse, the improvement extending from the juniors upwards. (Hear, hear!) He would not quote documents at any length, to establish the fact of the improvement in the junior division of the service; he did not conceive that it would be disputed, for he had all the highest authorities with him; and almost every person present must have the means of verifying the fact for himself, from the most authentic living testimonies. He might appeal not only to the authority of Lord Minto and Lord Hastings, but of several others, who had immediate opportunities of ascertaining the real state of the case. Even suppose those authorities were mistaken as to the cause, it was quite impossible for them to have mis-stated the effect; they might err in looking to the institution at home as an efficient source of the improvement they witnessed, but they could not possibly err as to the facts under their own eye. An Hon. Director (Mr. Bebb) had said, that when Lord Minto delivered his testimony asserting the good

effects produced on the habits of the students at Fort William by the previous education at Haileybury, there could have been only a few of the Haileybury students in India. In that opinion surely the Hon. Director was mistaken; for the first division of students left Haileybury about December 1807, and therefore in September 1810, when Lord Minto declared his sense of the value of the college at Haileybury, the students of the first two, if not the first three years, of Haileybury, had already arrived in India. But this was not the single testimony. General Hewitt, in August 1811, and Lord Minto, in September 1812, bore witness to the accelerated progress of the students at Calcutta in the Oriental languages, in consequence of their antecedent acquirements in Europe. In November 1812, Captain Roebuck, addressing the College Council at Fort William, observed it to be 'generally admitted as a fact, that the students then in college (at Fort William), compared with former years, were much steadier in every respect, which was perhaps owing to their previous education at Haileybury." On the 29th of December, in the same year, a still stronger attestation to the " very great and general improvement of the students at Fort William was given by the College Council of that institution, and that improvement was traced to the same cause. In 1815, Mr. Edmonstone, then officiating as visitor of the college at Fort William, spoke of the prudence and propriety of the general system of conduct then observable among the students at Fort William, and observed that "this gratifying improvement might perhaps be traced to sources beyond that establishment." Now granting that, in all these instances, the individuals cited were mistaken in their conjectures as to the causes of the improved habits they commended, with respect to the fact at least their evidence was unimpeachable. To crown these testimonies, he (Mr. Grant) would close with a passage from the last address of Lord Hastings, as visitor of the college at Fort William, delivered on the 23d August 1822, in which that noble person commended the junior civil servants of Bengal; and it would be observed that he quoted the passage simply as attesting the fact of the merits of the junior division of that service. Lord Hastings, referring to the instruction in the Oriental languages attained at the college of Fort Williain, remarked, "I will rest the argument upon the rapid succession of young men, who, after rigid and impartial examination, have been declared competent to the service of the state, by their acquirements in the necessary languages-not to dry official tasks alone; we have a proud consciousness that our functionaries have the capacity, not merely of discharging

adequately their engagements to their employers, but that they possess also the means of rendering incalculable services to the native inhabitants, by readily communicating explanation, instruction, or advice. The ability, however, to do this would be of little value, were the disposition wanting. It has not been wanting: with exultation I have learned from all quarters, the kind, the humane, the fostering spirit, manifested towards the natives, by the young men whom the college has sent forth to public trusts. What a triumph it would be to my heart, could I venture to suppose that my inculcations had any share in exciting this generous tone!" He (Mr. Grant) most willingly confessed that the inculcations of the Noble Marquis had their full share in producing these excellent effects; but, at the same time, he could not forget that most, if not all the gentlemen referred to in this eulogy, had completed their European education at Haileybury; at that college where it was now said the young men learned only idleness, extravagance and dissipation. Such were the fruits produced by the decried institution to which he alluded! (Cries of hear!) Did these publicly recorded opinions of responsible personages on the spot prove nothing? Were they to be countervailed by individual instances of folly or extravagance among a number of very young men congregated in the heart of a great and luxurious capital, and subjected to no controul? These, it might however be said, referred only to the Presidency of Bengal. With regard to Madras, he might refer to the whole series of the official reports of the College Council at Fort St. George, from 1814 downwards, documents too long to quote, but which spoke clearly and strongly in favour of the junior civil servants of that Presidency. He might also refer to the authority of the gentleman who sat beside him, and who had for many years been a distinguished member of the Revenue Board at Madras (Mr. Hodgson). That gentleman, who had not been educated at Hertford, and who could have no prejudice in favour of that establishment, kindly allowed him to refer to his authority for the fact, that a gradual improvement had of late years taken place in the civil service; that the debts of the junior civilians were little or nothing; that their habits of order and regularity were most praiseworthy. Indeed, the palpable fact of a great improvement, was confirmed by the general opinion of all who were competent to pronounce one. With regard to Bombay, he had at home a letter from a civilian at that Presidency who had been educated at Haileybury, and whom, from the description, he doubted not to be the same as had been alluded to by an Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Bebb) as having stated the fact of the

young writers there being in debt. That letter had been kindly placed in his hands by the person to whom it was addressed; and notwithstanding it mentioned that many of the commencing writers were in some degree in debt, a circumstance which the writer represented to be unavoidable, it on the whole afforded such a picture of the remarkably good and moral conduct of the young men upon the Bombay establishment, as it was impossible to contemplate without lively pleasure. If then, such be the general representations, and coming from various quarters, on this subject, he might, he thought, now confidently assert the fact of a general improvement in the state of the junior part of the service, to whatever cause that improvement might be attributed. That besides this, he had been at some pains to ascertain the situations filled in India by students who had received their education at Haileybury, and he was surprised to find the remarkably elevated stations which they occupied for their standing in India. He found, farther, that, generally speaking-let it be observed he did not say universally, but generally-the most important posts seemed to be filled by those who had been the most distinguished for proficiency at Haileybury. To prove this in detail would be a task of length, and one to which he confessed he was not competent, as it required great knowledge of the relative importance of different stations in the service: but fortunately there was a short proof of it which might satisfy any mind. It was, in the first place, a fact which the slightest comparison of the records of the College at Haileybury with those of the College at Fort William would establish, that the most distinguished students at the former, generally speaking, were also the most distinguished students of the latter. Now, the Marquess of Hastings had, in his discourse of August 1818, expressly said, respecting the college at Fort William, " look all around at the distinguished (individuals) of the civil service in the present day: is there one of those-I mean where the career commenced after the institution of the college (Fort William), whose character was not, in the first instance, brought to light by distinction acquired here?" The glory Lord Hastings thus claims for the college of Fort William, must evidently be participated with the sister institution at home; and what appeared to be true under the Presidency of Calcutta, was also generally true under the other presidencies. There were exceptions, doubtless, in all. Some who were not pre-eminent at the college in England, rose to distinction in India; but it did not follow that they did not owe much to their education bere. Trace, for instance, the honours and degrees conferred at the University of Cambridge, all which

are recorded, and then trace the subsequent career of the individuals who had received them. Many names would be found of conspicuous merit, both at college and in after life; but, on the other hand, not a few who had taken comparatively low degrees, subsequently became eminent: but was it thence to be inferred that they had derived no benefit from their previous education? Not so; he entirely concurred in the opinion of Lord Grenville, as to the benefit derivable, even from breathing the atmosphere of a wellconstituted seminary. Lessons were there written on the mind, as it were invisibly, which were subsequently brought out and made conspicuous by the heat of active life. (Hear!) Still it was a strong fact that eminence at Haileybury had usually been the forerunner of eminence in the civil service. He had been surprised to hear it urged in disparagement of the college, that in the course of only sixteen or seventeen years since the time of its first students landing in India, it had not yet afforded a governor to one of the presidencies! This was a singular charge enough: but it suggested to him to mention, that the institution had already furnished eminent individuals to the department of the secretaries to government, a department of the very highest importance and responsibility. Of five or six civil secretaries at Calcutta, three (Messrs. Mackenzie, Prinsep, and Sterling), were distinguished prize-men and proficients at Haileybury; of four secretaries at Madras, and four at Bombay, two in each place (Messrs. Clive and Macpherson Macleod at the former, and Messrs. Norris and Simson at the latter,) were of the same class; and a third (Mr. Farish) had just been promoted from the same situation at Bombay. If then, on the whole, it appeared that the average improvement of the junior portion of the civil service had corresponded with the average influx from the college at Haileybury, and if it also appeared that the brightest ornaments of the junior civil service had also been the brightest ornaments of the college at Haileybury, then, it seemed to him to be established with almost mathematical certainty, that the previous education at Haileybury had been productive of signal benefit to the civil service. But to these considerations he would add what he believed, on the best evidence within his reach, to be an undeniable fact that the individuals, who having gone out from the college, had distinguished themselves in India, very generally admitted their obligations to the course of education at that establishment. Had it been possible, indeed, to put the question to those gentlemen universally, he should not have feared to stake the fate of the institution on the general effect of the answers. All,

however, that was in his power he had done, by applying to as many of those now at home as he had access to, and to the friends and relations of others. He should not trouble the Court with the names of those, whose sentiments respecting the utility of the college in these several instances he had inquired, though he held a list of them in his hand, which he would readily shew to any person present; but he would state as the result, that having ascertained the opinions of no fewer than twenty-six gentlemen who had gone out to India from Haileybury, and most of whom had been highly distinguished at the college, he found that all distinctly concurred in avowing their great obligations to that institution; and, when it was considered that the individuals to whom he had referred had not been selected, but were all to whom he had access, he conceived their testimony to be of great weight. He wished, indeed, the Court to consider the real weight and effect of such testimony. It had formerly been said, that the distinguished students sent out from Haileybury were exceptions; it seemed to be thought that they had excelled, not in consequence of their connexion with the institution, but in spite of that connexion. Could this be said, when he produced, under their own hands, their own authority, as a decisive proof that they owed their subsequent elevation to their collegiate education at home? Why, on this subject, their evidence was not only admissible, it was clearly the best evidence. Every man of common faculties knew whether he had profited by his education at a particular seminary or not it was common to hear it said, “at such a school or college, I got great good; at such another, we did nothing; at such another, I improved much, but it was by private study, and not owing to the instructions of the place." In favour of the Hertford system, some strong and interesting acknowledgments of the nature referred to he had cited on a former occasion; he now held in his hand many more. It would have gratified him to communicate to the Court the cordial and fervent language in which several of the writers expressed their obligations to the seminary in question, and their opinion of its value; but, by way of sparing the time of the Court, he would be content with a single quotation : it was not from a private letter, but from a pamphlet published in 1823, and entitled "A Letter to the Chairman, Deputy Chairman, and Court of Directors of the East-India Company, on the subject of their College at Haileybury; by a Civilian." As the publication was anonymous, he would not name the author, though he had kindly disclosed his name to him but he understood that ill health had compelled him to quit India and the